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PostPosted: Sun Aug 27, 2017 2:23 am 
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Kind of an offbeat question. I have another deal I am messing with, it involves building a snarky 331W with a late sixties look for a '65 Falcon HT I own. I am running M/T valve covers with an edelbrock XF-8 ram log, and I am 100% committed to that. Here's the thing, I am running a flat tappet with a very aggressive lobe (278@.020, 252@.050, .596 gross with a 1.6 rocker) this cam really begs for a stud girdle, but I don't think the M/T valve covers will clear the intake plenums if I run a 1" valve cover spacer. Anyone running a stud girdle under the M/T's with just a thick gasket? I am ok running without baffles, the girdle will act similar to a baffle anyway.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 27, 2017 6:06 am 
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Not a lot of lift, and depending on the heads, not enough duration to really pull some high rpms. I personally don't think you'd need a stud girdle.

There are some 5/16" thick valve cover gaskets out there though, you could get a set and see if they help you out. You can always stack two pairs of those if you needed more than 5/16".

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 27, 2017 6:32 am 
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I like to use a girdle on anything with anything much more than 350lbs over the nose. I'm sure it will run ok without it, but the studs will deflect a measurable amount just turning it over on an engine stand, you gotta wonder what it's doing at 7500.
After I posted that, I thought I can probably save some space by using the old style moroso screw slot adjusters, especially if I machine some length off the threaded end, they are flush with the bar, should gain about 1/4".
To be honest, the only reason I am not putting a girdle on the Cleveland I am building is I am using aluminum Boss 351 valve covers, I want it to look more or less like a stock Boss 351 with a few bolt-ons.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 27, 2017 6:38 am 
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What heads? I don't think it will go 7500.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 27, 2017 7:21 am 
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They are right around 245@.600 on my bench. I am in SE Asia right now so don't have access to that computer, but EA Pro is saying peak power at 6800 rpm, so that's right around a 7500 rpm shift point.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 27, 2017 8:14 am 
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FWIW, the intake lobe is a Comp Cams MHF, that's a pretty serious lobe. Maybe you overlooked the 1.6 rocker? With a Cleveland rocker that would be .645 gross.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 27, 2017 12:01 pm 
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I'm confused. Is this a Windsor head or a Cleveland head?

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 27, 2017 6:13 pm 
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blykins wrote:
I'm confused. Is this a Windsor head or a Cleveland head?

It's a Windsor. That's why I put it in this section. I have a 351c that's going in my '67 falcon, but this is regarding a Windsor thats going in a '65.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 27, 2017 6:21 pm 
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Oh, I ain't worried about you posting about a Windsor build here. I was just confused because you put .595" lift, and then said it was .645" with a Cleveland rocker. I get confused easily. :)

Obviously, a stud girdle won't hurt anything, but with a 400-425 lb valve spring and a 7/16" rocker stud, I don't think you have anything to worry about if you don't use one. You should get zero rocker stud deflection at that level. You may get a hair of pushrod deflection, but a 7/16" rocker stud should not move.

My gut says it won't pull as high as you're thinking. That intake will not be conducive to easy flow as the fuel tends to fall out of suspension easily. I have also built 331 Windsors with similar camshafts and Trick Flow TW heads that peaked around 7000. Those heads were pushing closer to 300 cfm.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 27, 2017 7:45 pm 
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blykins wrote:
Oh, I ain't worried about you posting about a Windsor build here. I was just confused because you put .595" lift, and then said it was .645" with a Cleveland rocker. I get confused easily. :)

Obviously, a stud girdle won't hurt anything, but with a 400-425 lb valve spring and a 7/16" rocker stud, I don't think you have anything to worry about if you don't use one. You should get zero rocker stud deflection at that level. You may get a hair of pushrod deflection, but a 7/16" rocker stud should not move.

My gut says it won't pull as high as you're thinking. That intake will not be conducive to easy flow as the fuel tends to fall out of suspension easily. I have also built 331 Windsors with similar camshafts and Trick Flow TW heads that peaked around 7000. Those heads were pushing closer to 300 cfm.


I think I have a partial two-fold solution to the inherent fuel distribution/booster signal defects in that intake design, solution maybe not the right word, mitigation might be more accurate. I like stud girdles, I think they are one piece of equipment that is probably under-utilized. Maybe I will assemble it without one and put a dial indicator on the poly lock and turn it over, see how much the stud deflects. It would help the sixties look I am chasing if I don't need to use one. In my experience, EA Pro tends to be happy on gross hp, but it's usually pretty close at predicting where peak power occurs, but you may be right. I have ported a lot of Windsor heads over the years, but this is the first time I have built a short deck Windsor with a stroker crank, so you have much more first hand experience with this than I do. In keeping with the runner length and csa of the intake, I have tried to focus on building a combo that will focus more on midrange torque than high rpm. I am committed to the intake, but I recognize it's on the upper edge of its envelope for this combo, and is the limiting factor.
I don't have the csa of the heads with me, as I am on vacation, but as Windsor heads go, it's big. I drilled out the pushrod holes and pressed brass tubes into them and widened the pinch until I saw brass, and the csa is pretty constant through the port. There was a lot of cast iron dust. :lol:

I mentioned the Cleveland rocker because I thought you were in a "Cleveland" mindset when you said it wasn't much lift, I though it was quite a bit for a .875 250 degree flat tappet lobe with a 1.6 rocker. The only ones I have seen that are much bigger were from Bullit. But you are a pro builder with a relationship with Comp, so you may have access to lobes from them that I don't.


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